Thank you. Long before NASA was asked to put a man on the moon one engineer had already figured out how to get there. I looked at the picture and asked me what do you see in the picture and I wrote back. Well let's hear from from Sue Morse again science director for the organization keeping track. They get a lot of media attention but compared to the the amount of times that a mountain lion could attack a person but doesn't because they don't typically view us as prey. I've had a number of people call up and say I found a scout in the woods and I want it DNA identified. New Hampshire Public Radio | As far as I could tell there was a positive DNA sequence coming from the scat sample Patrick. There wasn't a distinct subspecies the North American mountain lion is all is all one species and then you can find a genetically distinct South American subspecies. Squam Lake: Home of mountain lions - Concord Monitor We are the second most-forested state in the country, and those forests can be impenetrable snarls (part of why the Northeast is notoriously a difficult place to hunt deer), and while there are people in a lot of those woods, because the cats have been absent for a few generations now, most of those people dont know what a cougar scrape or latrine look and smell like. The unheralded hero of Apollo John Hubble the man who knew the way to the moon. Tim Yeah. But are there mountain lions living in New Hampshire? So here we have you know a very qualified biologist who who found a print took a plaster cast found a scat send it to a university. N.H.'s Fish and Game department says there's no proof. Your support makes this news available to everyone. If you believe you have seen a mountain lion and want to report it to NH Fish and Game, please contact the Wildlife Division at (603) 271-2461 or wildlife@wildlife.nh.gov to request an observation report form. Just one quick point I think I think when we we talk about these conspiracy theories the real story is that fish and game is an agency that that is short on budget and staff. 235 or nhandy@ledgertranscript.com. Second when I when they did forward it from Wyoming to to Michigan you know this was coming right from sample 18 and 19 had no remarkable differences from known mountain lions from Michigan or Wyoming. Well just that I have evidence and it was not it was denied by fishing game at the time and I you know there's I don't need to prove to anybody that I saw one just like some of your callers said okay. Sam what's the incentive for the government to deny allegedly. Residents believe cougars still roam New Hampshire's forests So I've been convinced the whole time that I saw a big cougar plume or whatever you want to call it standing there in the road in Greenfield. About two years ago I was at the Laconia airport on the way home from the airport and there's a big lake on one side called Lily Pond. By Eric Orff. Peter Biello: We mentioned that the eastern cougar and the Western cougar are they were separate eastern cougar believed to be extinct. What kind of animal is that. DNA from scat or from fur, a clear track that is confirmed by an expert, or a photo that clearly shows a mountain lion. Deer Bear Moose Grey Wolf Coyote Foxes Fisher Mountain Lion NH Wildlife History. Pat humans people leave deer carcasses up in trees. Peter Biello: So Patrick today Fish and Game no downward pressure on you to deny the existence at all costs of mountain lions here in New Hampshire. Sam Evans-Brown: Pretty well I was going to say it is nice to hear about how to identify the facial markings but probably I'd being a to identify the tracks is probably the more useful useful tool that one can have in their tool box. Sam Evans Brown. If you go on YouTube and search mount lion Pat you can see people patent their hundred pound kiddie like its regular mascot cat. Caller: Oh hi. Peter Biello: Well yeah. Less than a year later I found a scat on the swamp range and I was working at the time with a fellow at the Michigan wildlife habitat Federation. You know interactions are pretty unusual. Sam Evans-Brown: Certainly that is a thing I've heard but again you have to think of the incentives involved here. And so. OK. That location they just described we had two or three Bobcats radio collared on just off the runway in Laconia airport. Patrick Tate: Yes. The females disperse a shorter range and once they find a vacant home range they stay in that location and live there. Mountain Lion | Squam Lakes Natural Science Center So so. In fact, Pat Tate concedes that hes been told of sightings from folks that he considers to be very credible, very woods savvypeople who know what a bobcat looks likebut those folks have never snapped a good photo or found a good track. And trying to figure out the little pieces to identify him so I bring up the names the differences but the appearances can be confusing for some. Gotcha, so the Deep State is suppressing mountain lion news in order to prop up New Hampshire tourism? From "History of New Hampshire Game and Furbearers" by Helenette Silver, Research Clerk, NH Fish and Game Dept. 44-N Links. So so do what you can get to do what you can to get proof. Sam Evans-Brown: One in fact Helena silver in that sort of tome that Rick van de Poll read from at the beginning is she. This is not the same as saying that there has never been a mountain lion seen in New Hampshire. The most common areas to see mountain lions in Arizona are in places of rocky and mountainous terrain. That's pretty elaborate. I hope she's listening and she had spoke to a lot of different people ended up having a couple of sightings of her alone without sort of by accident. Peter Biello: This is the exchange on an HP yard today we're talking about the mysterious elusive majestic Mystic Mountain Lion. But on the other side of that coin there is this sense that there have been so many sightings locally and you guys Patrick you might recall the name the Wyndham McCracken she kind of turned herself into a local authority off authorities the right word but she was very dedicated to this. NHPR is nonprofit and independent. Well thanks for sharing. New Hampshire Fish and Game Department says there's no proof. So I think the point that I just want to get across is that there is a very strong sense this here in the and not region that there is that there is some sort of mountain lion population how large it is how extensive it is. On Oct. 10, he gave a slide talk called "Wild Cats of New Hampshire," which included the bobcat and the lynx. And it was you know 10 or 12 people saw it all at once. Mountain Lions in New England: Sightings, Science & Bobcat vs Mountain Lion Yes. Well I can't tell you what you saw. They're the generalists that made it through both the arrival of the Clovis people with their with their spears and then the Europeans with their guns. When you talk about a bobcat Bobcat maybe 80 90 pounds and then a mountain lion could be between 130 and 180 pounds. This is the exchange. So nowadays we think of this in the Northeast as crazy stuff that people have a mountain lion as a pet. You know one of the the biggest questions I have about that is it points to how much we don't know and if in fact we don't know enough. So. I have no doubt that there are mountain lion roaming New Hampshire. And I can recall its information but I can't confirm or verify anything. You know I'm like seriously I can't get a picture of the thing but what it what it is. Peter Biello: From New Hampshire Public Radio I'm Peter Biello in for Lark Knoy and this is the exchange. I mean that so many of them are false sightings we. HOLDERNESS, N.H. (AP) Two of the known mountain lions in New Hampshire have spent their 15 years in close proximity to humans. And I saw you cat about four feet long from nose to tail come across from the water across the road and just leap over a six foot perimeter fence in a single bound. John thanks. Peter Biello: Well Karl Jarvis a former reporter for The King's son Nile thank you very much for for calling in and sharing your perspective and to his point Patrick T. I mean yes we haven't met the scientific burden of proof here in New Hampshire as far as physical evidence is is concerned but is there room at Fish and Game For A kind of an informal nod to all of the people who have somehow convinced themselves and possibly some others that yeah there may be occasional sightings here. And now that everyone and their mother has a remote camera in their back yard its just so, so unlikely that there are resident, breeding mountain lions in New England that are living invisibly among us, he says, Its become Big Foot.. Caller: And the more I thought about it the color of it it was definitely not a bobcat. When they were landing or taking off and it seems like it's been there for like. The Lions of New Hampshire: MD44 Links. However if if and when it does happen it takes up a lot of resources looking at that situation and identifying what's going on because when you start out you don't know it's a hoax. Thank you for visiting the New Hampshire Fish and Game Department website. I wasn't employed as biologists at the time of a situation that's been reported but so I started digging into this report and spoke with another wildlife biologist with the agency and said Do you know anything about this. Listeners give us a call if you'd like. So I want to start the program with a comment from someone who is not in the studio with us today. It traveled all the way from from you know Minnesota to New York without being so seen Patrick take. Don't miss your chance to win three two thousand dollar gas gift cards at any station of your choice not to mention the grand prize twenty five thousand dollars toward a new car. Patrick Tate: Same here in New Hampshire too. They create these scrapes where theyre communicating with each other with scent. Early in the morning. Thank you very much for being here. Sam Evans-Brown: So Tim so this cat's been been referenced a couple of times I think we should talk about it specifically lay the whole story out for folks who haven't heard the story because it's actually I think really indicative of a lot of stuff for talking about. Really appreciate you guys being here as well. 1,470 likes. Rick van de Poll: 80 90. Caller: I do. But Absence of Evidence Is Not Evidence of Absence, Right? 1957. So the U.S. Forest Service Rocky Mountain Research Station has a database on mountain lion and they can identify. Mike you're on the air. You don't know what's going on. And I have to use that word allegedly because there is so much dispute about what people see and what they actually see. Current conditions in New Hampshire would support a mountain lion, according to Tate, as forests have returned, allowing for prey species to become more prevalent. Rick van de Poll: Well I didn't. We'll hear more about the mountain lions impact and the role it plays in the ecosystem. Alleged mountain lion sightings put Derry, Windham residents on edge We actually have the largest subspecies of bobcat in the northern part of our state which they can get up to 40 and over 40 pounds which looks like an 80 pound the animal to visually and quite large. It was some sort of a Lion Mountain Lion animal. The best documentation we have in New Hampshire suggests there hasnt been a mountain lion killed by a hunter in this state since 1885. The panther, Fells concolor, is a beast of many names, most frequently referred to in New Hampshire history as catamount, but sometimes known locally as "Indian Devil" or "Carcajou", under which . Why do people keep seeing mountain lions (which aren't here) but not Updated: 9:53 AM EST Dec 6, 2016. Patrick Tate: Well. That's the real story is they can't follow up on every one of these sightings. And we want to know your stories if you have them 1 800 8 9 2 6 4 7 7 or email exchange at an HP bar dot org we'll talk about conspiracy theories when we come back. Monday, December 5th: Mountain Lions in New Hampshire? Part II Sam Evans-Brown: I just want to say the bang and word you just heard I think to me exemplifies why it's really hard to come up with with positive you know 100 percent certain evidence that you've that what you've got is a mountain lions. Have it reported down in the Keene area. Okay. Patrick Tate: I would say well when social media first started they picked up the hoaxes became much more prevalent in the last four or five years hoaxes have died down completely. I mean it wasn't your idea. From: Boomerdog in OK 08-Oct-07 Mountain Lions | Wildlife | New Hampshire Fish and Game Department Id like to hazard the explanation that we really, really want to see a mountain lion. People were calling the New Hampshire Fish and Game director's office saying why are you dragging your feet on this. So you want identifiable backgrounds. If you have them email exchange at an HP board or give us a call to tell us your story. He says when youve got a mountain lion in town, its kinda obvious. Michael Brindley is our program manager our producers our Jessica Hunt and Christina Phillips and our theme music was composed by Bob Lord. I just stood there just a second and I came to a complete stop and then I ran away. Peter Biello: So a little bit of nostalgia maybe for it for a better world embodied in the mountain lion. There are corollaries in other states. So for our scientists to do the lumping and whatnot. Mountain Lions in NH. I wanted to get your thoughts on the mystique of the mountain lion start with you Rick. Peter Biello: We at this e-mailed comment from Michael. So Michael follows with the question. JavaScript must be enabled for some features to display properly. SUE Morse naturalist and science director for the organization keeping track. The species that once inhabited the Northeast, known as the eastern mountain lion, is now extinct. Not one picture of him online while the person meet with us. As I tried to get a picture of it so there was it was definitely we looked up all the pictures and it was definitely not a bobcat or anything else being it looked just like a mountain lion. nh.gov | privacy policy | accessibility policy
Peter Biello: Give us a call 1 800 8 9 2 6 4 7 7 you can also send us an email exchange at an HP morgue. Patrick Tate: Well I've never seen an Easter cougar so I can't say when I've handled these 10 cougars and whatnot. The big cat has been extinct here since the mid-1800s. If youd like to submit a question (or send a mountain line photo) you can record it as a voice memo on your smart phone and send it tooustidein@nhpr.org, OR call our hotline, 1-844-GO-OTTER (1-844-466-8837) and leave a message. Mountain lion or cat running across. Windham Life and Times - November 15, 2019 And so far we have not had any positive mark lion scats or any DNA. Which goes back to the Connecticut Connecticut cat and what not. Which which I think Pat and I have both experienced. Sam Evans-Brown: Well first I want to sort of explain why what the theory is but then also throw a bit of cold water on it because I don't think there's much much logic behind it but essentially is that if fish and game were to acknowledge that there was a population of Mount lions in the state there's a chance that something like a listing under the federal Endangered Species Act might happen and then there'd be you know some they'd have to put a plan in place to protect the species there'd be you know restrictions put on development. Peter Biello: So if they were female mountain lions here they would be more males just because that's what they're looking for. It all used to be based on measurable physical traits color, skull size, paw size, etc but now its based on whether an animal can be shown to be genetically distinct from others. We have evidence and as biologists we would find it quite exciting to find that evidence of one in the state. Peter Biello: This is the exchange on an PR. So for those reasons I don't believe the standards are too high the amount of game cameras out on the landscape to record images department alone through contracts had over 150 throughout the state biologists go through various deer yards throughout the year. Think You Saw A Mountain Lion in N.H.? - New Hampshire Public Radio Like why would you want one wildlife. Residents believe cougars still roam New Hampshire's forests What gets confusing is when you have a large adult animal and a smaller juvenile animal of a different species you can now step start beginning talking about overlapping body weights and sizes. Monadnock Ledger-Transcript - Claims of mountain lions spread Chartered 1973; Member of District 44-H; . The supervisor that hired me in the game division in October of 1978 passed on to me this whole big folder of mountain lion information and sightings going back probably a couple decades. Give today. Lions Clubs Int'l Links: LionNet NH Links 2011 -2012 . Patrick Tate: Exactly I was gonna bring that up juvenile male of. Email exchange it an HP fraud org or give us a call 1 800 8 9 2 6 4 7 7. 1957. Patrick Tate: I've had hunters hang deer carcasses forbidding wildlife entries. That's why we always go back to the physical evidence to support what they're reporting. I just saw the head and the tail that was leaving. What do you think that. Caller: Are probably. And there are thousands of mountain lions killed every year legally through hunting, and there have been untold tens of thousands of mountain lions killed by hunters over the last hundred years, says Mark Elbroch, the Puma Program Director for Panthera, a global wild cat conservation organization, So even the folks who live with mountain lions still have a fancy and see something thats not there to me thats incredible.. Numerous scat and fur specimens have been turned in as part of mountain lion report investigations; DNA identification has shown these submitted samples to be from domestic dog, coyote, bobcat andraccoon. But you won't find evidence of their existence in paw prints in the snow or a deer carcass in a tree. Infinite Scroll Enabled. Do we have native species that could have exhibited this type of behavior leaving leaving a deer carcass up in a tree. The western mountain lion lives in a more of a grassland open area now so to blend in with a very lighted situation here in the Northeast we are very shadowy dark situation because of the forest and our cats wear a darker brownish reddish color than what they were and they were also smaller than what the western mountain lion is. But you won't find evidence of their existence in paw prints in the snow or a deer carcass in a tree. We'll be right back. In my New Hampshire career I have written several, and seen at least 20, stories along the lines of "local person thinks they saw a mountain lion but there's no actual evidence aside from. So Pat you field a lot of calls about people seeing or reportedly seeing mountain lions. We'd love to have you in the queue. Caller: I cannot recall or see the tail in my in my image of it. I believe I saw one that's fine and I'm not looking for an immediate story. Someone's got to see one they're very secretive. Fish and Game then deny the evidence. I have one that's more elaborate than that. That's next time on one day. And those are not the same things. www.wildlife.state.nh.us, Buy or Renew Your Saltwater Fishing License, Great Bay National Estuarine Research Reserve. He played a pivotal role and he battled for recognition. We rely on readers like you to support the local, national, and international coverage on this website. If you missed part of today's program listen to the exchange. Rick shaking his head so Rick now correct me please. They are the same thing. Have you heard stories do you have questions about the mountain line. Peter Biello: Nice to be here. So that that's more or less I think why I'm here and why I got into this in nineteen ninety nine I found a what appeared to be a print of a mountain lion and that was in the Osprey mountains and I thought well OK that's that's a print. And what was really remarkable about the whole thing was I was maybe a half mile down on all buildings. How to Report a Possible Mountain Lion Sighting. Peter Biello: Well Mike thanks very much for sharing your story. So if you were to ask me has a mountain lion ever passed through New Hampshire and been spotted by somebody who wasnt able to get hard evidence? Id personally be willing to say "probably, yes.". Thanks also to Rick van de Poll naturalist and founder of ecosystem management consultants of New England and Sam Evans Brown host of an HP podcast outside in about the natural world and how we use it. It's not a skinny rope like tail like a housecat. So there is definitely no downward pressure by anyone. BRADFORD, N.H. - All that snow in parts of the Northeast has more than just kids jumping for winter joy. Want to report a Mountain Lion sighting in New Hampshire? Contact the Wildlife Division at (603) 271-2461 or wildlife@wildlife.nh.gov to request an observation report form. Peter Biello: Worth mentioning if we're scaring anybody question a mysterious mountain lions lurking perhaps in someone's backyard. Is there a way we can learn more about these dispersing mountain lions that may travel through the Granite State and that I would ask you certainly part about whether or not a he's spending too much time chasing down these kind of false leads or B would rather be doing something else that is more informative to whether or not we actually have or can prove that we have dispersing mountain lions in the state. So it's there was no question in my mind. There have been several sightings of mountain lions in New Hampshire recently. It is also known as cougar, panther, mountain lion, and puma, though catamount is the preferred regional vernacular. They just end up in these places. Peter Biello: And Carl before you continue I think Patrick Tate just give me a second. On a dirt road. Me Im willing to believe its possible that there are some out there. So now what's going on. Peter Biello: And that will make identification for a layperson rather difficult. OK. Sue Morse: First and foremost if you have color or if you could see details of color look at the front of the face around the Pumas muzzle the muzzle itself is pure white. Anyways after three weeks I finally found the image on line on a field and stream photo contest and the explanation in the end was the person that set the camera out with another individual and they believed that someone who knew of the camera location saw the similarities put the can't picture on their SD card so it looked like that camera recorded the image that is. The number 1 800 8 9 2 6 4 7 7 so promised a discussion about conspiracy theories. And I think a lot of folks would like them to be around. Peter Biello: So Rick seems like you agree that the tail is a big giveaway whether or not it's a mountain lion Absolutely. They lived perhaps elsewhere in New England and they were just passing through and happened to have an encounter of some sort. Many people in New Hampshire have claimed to have seen mountain lions. Something along those lines. From came from out west they tracked it all the way back to the Black Hills in the Dakotas. So it is possible to see male Mountain lions roam into the northeast - there was one hit by a car in CT a number of years back - but we don't have a breeding population of Mountain lions in New England. WMUR NH Chronicle Mountain Lions in NH Part I and Part II. Yes and you want to share what you learned. The great thing about pictures isn't the animal itself it's the background. It was in the spring flash kind of early summer and my wife looked at you look at the size of an adult bear and we were up in arms. From involving members in projects as local as cleaning up an area park or as far-reaching as bringing sight to the world's blind, Lions clubs have always . It doesn't make much sense because you know mountain lions are as we as we said before. Sam Evans-Brown: So I just had two thoughts which is that we hear a lot of these stories and all of us here have heard these stories. A monthly donation of $5 makes a real difference. Do they travel. The report came in from a conservation officer. Its closest living relative is the cheetah. HOLDERNESS, N.H. (AP) Two of the known mountain lions in New Hampshire have spent their 15 years in close proximity to humans. N.H. Residents Report Mountain Lion Sighting - NECN Peter Biello: Oh okay. Caller: It had to be a mountain lion convinced I was about 30. They kill big animals. Rick your thoughts. I would say that there's going to be the truth in here somewhere. So. Rick van de Poll: Well the mountain lion of course has been sort of an enigma in the wildlife suite for years and years. And there's there's no evidence of that cat's movement in that entire you know 12 hundred miles stretch of its journey. Sunny today high temperatures low to mid 80s it'll be clear tonight overnight lows in the 50s for tomorrow sunshine with high temperatures mid to upper 80s. Residents believe cougars still roam New Hampshire's forests - AP NEWS It's unfortunate that that kind of thing happens as often as it does. We had six copies printed out each. So when we talk about the threshold of evidence required to say for sure you have seen a mountain lion it is rather high. So I learned about what Rick just reported through a heart of heart of New Hampshire a letter and. The brother and sister big cats have lived . and territorial animals are much more inclined to create a problem with passer bys than dispersing animals in fact I'd be totally shocked if a dispersal would encounter with a human purposefully unless they had already had some type of training to do so. Sam Evans-Brown: But I mean the video I had been sent was you know a recording of a animal growling but it was in slow motion and when I asked the person why is this in slow motion the denied that it was so there's a lot of weird stuff that happens in regards to people claiming they've seen they've seen these things. Do cougars live in New England? Patrick Tate: I've from all the situations I've read and learned about wildlife. A lot of times. Tell us your story. The tail leave is a giveaway but not everybody gets to see the tail. Pat ruse and he was sampling doing DNA samples from cats in the Upper Peninsula of Michigan. Since 1917, Lions clubs have offered people the opportunity to give something back to their communities. Mountain Lions in New Hampshire-Fact or Fiction 3,207 views Jul 31, 2019 78 Dislike Share Save New Hampshire Fish and Wildlife 634 subscribers During my thirty-one career at the New. Rick van de Poll: Yes. Really appreciate it. Sam Evans-Brown: What he would have stopped as well I think is way way that the reason that mountain lion kept moving is because he wasn't finding anybody. Known to exist in the state for over well over a hundred years. So when we hear mountain lion there's also cougar there's wild cat there's Bobcat which is not a mountain lion maybe Patrick could you sort of spell out the different terms which are synonymous and which are completely different animals. Peter Biello: This is the exchange on an HD PR fine Peter Biello and today we're talking with folks who can tell us about the mysterious elusive mountain line and whether or not it is actually here in New Hampshire.